1

(25 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

lie2815 wrote:

...you're viewing it from your perspective only...

No, you're the one doing that. See how useful and constructive that observation is?
Your arguments against using 'Download' as a link to download the software are mainly nonsense. Either that or hundreds of projects have got it wrong and you've got it right with 'Get Name-of-project-that-people-already-know'. Why use one word when two or more would do the same job?!

lie2815 wrote:

Oh, one more: If you really need to access certain pages really quickly, create a bookmark page for yourself.

We're discussing the menu architecture for this site - not providing a lesson in how to use a browser. Why would that need explaining that to you?

lie2815 wrote:

...you are user, too...

No, I'm not. You appear to be defining words to justify whatever it is you originally thought was good idea. Many people that come to the project are not 'users' they are developers who take the script and install it for other people to *use*.
Here's a clear and simple definition of an addon, rather than the one you picked from somewhere: "something to expand something else". Language pack and all the others fit neatly in to that. And it's not a "trick" to reference and understand the meaning of words.
And isn't it laughable - a project for forum software isn't going to provide a main menu link to its own forum! Amazing.
I've seen people like you before in projects - immediately defensive and threatened by anyone who suggests you could have done things better. Let's just hope the forum software isn't influenced by this muddled, obstinate, self-justifying attitude.
I'll file this under "you can lead a horse to water...". Carry on as you were.

2

(25 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

OK, as WWIII hasn't errupted yet wink, I'll try and clarify:

The main links should provide for what visitors want in order of use and priority, so I'd suggest main menu like so:

> FluxBB (with logo) | Home . About . Download . Forum . Wiki . Addons . Development . Contact

1. No one is going to be confused about what they will get from that menu with the Download link. It's completely intuitive. To suggest otherwise is silly. It could also provide links to the addons / extras and then do away with the 'Addons' link.
2. Forum should be up front and available - it's always going to be the primary method of communication for most people. It's a real nuisance to have to go hunting for it.
3. There's some confusion over terminology. I'm not an 'end user'. I (usually) install and customise and hand over to end users. So, 'User Documentation' is misleading. Also, by calling it what is - Wiki - lets me know that it is community-edited. That's a selling point for me. A project that encourages community participation is far preferable to one that tries to keep everything 'under control'.
4. Calling the extras / addons 'Resources' is simply too vague - just on the dictionary definition: *Something that one uses to achieve an objective*. It tells me nothing about what might be there. To repeat: it could be documentation, links to other sites, tutorials, recommended tools, etc. 'Addons' is much more descriptive and covers modifications, plugins, styles and language packs. Just because Mozilla use 'addons' for browser plugins does not mean other projects can't use it.
5. 'Contact' could hold IRC, international forums, etc. - and if you wanted to offer paid support later, it would go here.

Minor details to some, but I think important.

HTH.

EDIT - Also, international forums should be linked from the main forum.

3

(25 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

OK, I can see you're see getting defensive and missing the points. As you were.

4

(25 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

1. "being worked on"? There's already one from the competition a while back - in use now as the favicon. Is that being dumped?
2. 'Download' is pretty obvious - what else would it be but FluxBB?! smile
3. 'Addons' perhaps? 'Resources' just tells the visitor nothing - it could be documentation, links to other sites, tutorials, etc. - 'mystery meat navigation'
4. A forum is possibly the most frequently clicked link on a project like this - I'd suggest that it should be available as a 'level 1' menu option
5. 'User Guide' suggests only end-user docs. Will it not contain info on installing, upgrading, template creation, plugin dev, core dev, roadmaps, etc.? Call it 'Wiki' or 'Documentation' and it's clear that it's more than just end-user stuff.

I just found http://www.jamierf.co.uk/2009/10/21/flu … -progress/ and would like to give some minor feedback:

1. where's the logo?!
2. 'Get FluxBB' - why not just 'Download'? Less clutter, straight to the point
3. 'Resources' - no idea what this might link to. It could be anything. Can it be made clearer?
4. 'Community' - is this the forum link? If so, call it what it is - 'Forum'
5. 'User Guide' - will it just be an end-user guide or more than that? Call it 'Documentation' and you're safe

Apart from that, looks nice and clean.

6

(189 replies, posted in Announcements)

Connor and team,

All sounds good to me - good, pragmatic decisions. 

Also, very good to see you're encouraging involvement.  I'll try and give some time once I've cleared up my current project.

7

(155 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

Very nice logo, Christian.  Simple, elegant.  Perfect for Flux.

8

(9 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

katexter wrote:

Actually, google won't penalize for duplicate title and description. My site's php code is poor at SEO but is still ranking for specific keywords.

It's best not to speak in absolutes about SEO - what's true today may be false next week, and it's impossible to be certain what weighting is given to the hundreds of factors used to determine SERPs.  All we can do is follow Google guidelines and best practices, e.g. avoid duplicate content, provide unique and meaningful meta title + description.  Flux is already very good, and this little tweak would make it even better.

P.S.  I didn't receive notification of replies, hence delay in replying.

9

(9 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

Prompted by discussion at http://fluxbb.org/forums/topic/1667/usi … ser-forum/

Flux is currently populating meta description with e.g.:

<meta name="description" content="Using FluxBB in Production Environment - 16,000 User Forum (Page 1) - FluxBB discussion - FluxBB.org Forums  -  Unfortunately no one can be told what FluxBB is - you have to see it for yourself." />

...and meta title:

<title>Using FluxBB in Production Environment - 16,000 User Forum (Page 1) - FluxBB discussion - FluxBB.org Forums</title>

We're therefore getting lots of duplicate content - between 'title' and 'description' and also with all post descriptions containing category name and tag line.  That's not good for SEO. 

Google probably gives some weight to meta description as a ranking factor (http://www.vaughns-1-pagers.com/interne … actors.htm + http://www.seomoz.org/article/search-ranking-factors), so making this different to meta title is important. 

Google (+Yahoo) use it for SERPs description, e.g. http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=using+ … production - so people are just seeing duplicate content.  Providing unique content may provide extra keywords that make the SERP more visually appealing and likely to be clicked.

I think a better solution would be to take the first 200 characters of the first post for topics.  Forums should use title and description ("FluxBB discussion - Any other FluxBB related discussion.").  The forum root should output title and tag ("FluxBB.org Forums - Unfortunately no one can be told what FluxBB is - you have to see it for yourself.").

10

(79 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

MattF wrote:

Just because table free layouts are the 'in thing' at the moment ...

If by "at the moment" you mean the last 8 years, you'd be correct - but you don't, so you're not.

Try reading pretty much every article published by ALA over the last 8 years.  I have.  It was very enlightening.  Also, glancing at my book shelf, I'd recommend:

* User-Centred Web Design / Cato
* Eric Meyer on CSS
* Taking Your Talent to the Web / Zeldman

Once you've read all that, your opinion on web design will be <strike>a little better</strike> informed.

11

(79 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

Paul,

True, I don't find IE6 that difficult to code for either (with use of cond.comms.) - although surprised you've found it *that* easy for a fairly complex layout, such as this.


Eliot,

W3 Schools is a very techie site, so their stats are not indicative of the 'average'. http://www.w3counter.com/globalstats.php may be a better measure - which I looked at before making my OP.  Like I said, it would be an aggressive strategy - but one I'd support just to help bury IE6.


MattF,

Hot tip: don't talk to people like they're dickheads if you don't want a response in kind.

12

(79 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

Paul wrote:

Its fine for 37 Signals who have a captive audience but not for the web generally.

Their audience is really no more captive than FluxBB.  37s do not have a product monopoly.  If this decision were going to alienate large numbers of their users, they would not be doing it.

If 37s make a business or design decision, it's usually not a bad idea to look at it closely.  Investing a disproportionate amount of development time for a dying browser, at the expense of 'good stuff', isn't a good strategy.

Also, by dropping support for an obsolete browser gives a clear signal that the project is looking to the future.  And, of course, it doesn't prevent those who need it to cond. comment for IE6.


MattF wrote:

That's complete bollocks and a totally blinkered attitude.

Persuasive argument.

And who are you?

13

(79 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

Absolutely.  Tables are for tabular data.  Most of the forum is composed of lists.

I'd argue about user list being a table - it's called a 'list' for starters!

I'd also be tempted to follow 37s's lead and drop IE6 support.  It's an aggressive strategy, but I think it's justified and will help to consign IE6 to the dustbin of the web - where it belongs.

14

(57 replies, posted in FluxBB discussion)

1. 'flux' = 'flux capacitor' =
     Roads?  Where we're going we don't need roads! (possible copyright issues with Universal Studios) tongue

2. Everything that you need and nothing that you don't

3. More conversation, less clutter

4. Less bloat, more banter

5. Flux's acronym =
     Fast. Light. User-friendly. eXtensible

Well, if I click on that I *do* go to the topic - it just happens to be positioned at your post. 

However, I admit it's not the 'official' topic URL... so fair point. smile

The topic is in the browser address bar and the permalinks (which position the viewport to individual posts).  The forum is second to last in the breadcrumb.

Next. wink

17

(7 replies, posted in Feature requests)

I'd vote for duplication (or even moving) to bottom.  People are much more often going to subscribe after they've read the thread (and therefore positioned at the bottom) than before reading it.

permalink != breadcrumb

1. "Consistency Breeds Familiarity" - http://www.useit.com/alertbox/breadcrumbs.html (2/3 down the page)

2. "never have a link that points to the current page" - #10 at http://www.useit.com/alertbox/20031110.html (this also applies to 'Index' when on the home page)

This convention is followed by:

* http://groups.google.com/group/rec.food … pics?hl=en
* http://www.amazon.com/b/ref=amb_link_46 … d_i=502394
* http://tech.yahoo.com/pr/nikon-d40/1994466305
* http://cell-phones.listings.ebay.com/PD … esTextFeat
* http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobatpro/

I didn't cherry pick those - they represent the most popular web destinations and they're all consistent.  For the sake of usability, Flux should follow this de facto standard - unless there is a really good overriding reason to do it differently, which there doesn't appear to be.

20

(32 replies, posted in Feature requests)

Leaving aside personal preference, W3C / WCAG provides a recommendation which should take precedence: http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/SCR24.html

Jérémie wrote:

Then people won't validate their preview, thinking their writing is posted.

It still says 'Preview of your reply' in the blue bar above the preview, so 'This is how your post will appear once submitted' is redundant.  It should be removed.

And anyway, if someone clicks 'Preview' and thinks the post has been submitted, they've only got themselves to blame. tongue

22

(32 replies, posted in Feature requests)

I'm not a fan of the current method. 

I use Tab Mix Plus which allows me to force all links to open in current tab - it's then my choice to open links in new tabs.  The FluxBB implementation means that when I CTRL+click 'BBCode', for example, I don't get a new tab and the link opens in current tab.  Irritating.

I'd prefer:

function externalLinks() { 
 if (!document.getElementsByTagName) return; 
 var anchors = document.getElementsByTagName("a"); 
 for (var i=0; i<anchors.length; i++) { 
   var anchor = anchors[i]; 
   if (anchor.getAttribute("href") && 
       anchor.getAttribute("rel") == "external") 
     anchor.target = "_blank"; 
 } 
} 
window.onload = externalLinks;

23

(75 replies, posted in Announcements)

SuperMAG wrote:

oh new one ... what does LMAO means

SuperMAG, Google.  Google, SuperMAG.  We'll leave the two of you to get acquainted.  Take your time.  Book a hotel room.

I think sigs + the preview description ("This is how your post will appear once submitted.") would benefit from a little styling to separate them from the content above / below them.

Forking hell.